If it matters whether someone is a true or false prophet or apostle of God then it must also matter that there be a foolproof way of finding out whether they are true or false. Just saying they are true or false based on personal preference without solid proof is useless. Just because they agree with themselves, or with each other is not sufficient. So what is sufficient proof?

“Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will recognize them by their fruits. Matt.7:15-16.

False prophets will show their true selves in what they say.

Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’ Matt.7:21-23.

According to Jesus Christ (not my words) any prophet that preaches lawlessness is false. Lawlessness means denying the validity and importance of the Law/Covenant/10 Commandments in salvation. Any person that believes these false prophets or apostles are also lawless. Both Paul and EGW do this.

“Everyone then who hears these words of mine and does them will be like a wise man who built his house on the rock." Matt. 7:24.

Here Jesus is saying that we should listen to and understand HIS WORDS, not the words of false prophets or apostles. Then in order to prove ourselves wise we must DO (deeds of obedience) those words. Saying that deeds do not matter with respect to salvation is also denying the words of Jesus, and proves the false message of those false prophets or apostles.

The house is the Kingdom of Heaven in which we all must be to be saved. The rock is the truth upon to which the Kingdom of Heaven (house) must be attached by it's foundation, which is the words of Jesus Christ as given to us by his own eyewitness disciples. An apostle or prophet is ALWAYS proven false if they disagree with the words and testimony of Jesus Christ IN ANY DEGREE.

To use the words of anyone other than Jesus Christ in this way is taking the great risk of mistaking a false prophet or apostle for a true one, and that could be fatal. To me it is just not worth the risk.

Good post John, because if we listen to the wrong prophet, lets say a Joseph Smith etc., and follow him, we would be going in the wrong direction. Not to say that all he said was wrong, but he did not show his followers to read the bible.

pk

The people of the world have picked and chosen the prophets they wanted to follow. What I find that is interesting is that perhaps all of these so called prophets have stated that Jesus was the greatest prophet of all.

Well then if this is true, why can't we all just get along by going back to this Greatest Prophet and follow what He said and taught? Again, give me one good reason for having all of these so called modern prophets when none of them agree with one another? Is your answer "To confuse us?"

Dr. Rich I think I've mentioned before that all these so called prophets do not point people to Jesus or God, they point you to there way of thinking. Unlike the prophets in the Bible or EGW who pointed all to Jesus and his Bible.

pk

I could have said it better:

In the end, none of our religions can save us. We should not allow anything that others say or do, even if they claim direct revelations from God, to affect our own relationship with God, except for drawing us closer. The scriptures give us the basic requirements on what we must do if we want to become members of the Kingdom of God.

There are just a few requirements we need to meet before we receive our membership cards.

1. We must demonstrate loyalty to God alone, even if it results in a gruesome death.

2. We must have the heart of a dedicated servant who loves his master supremely and will serve him faithfully even if no one else does.

3. We must recognize that all other human beings, no matter how evil or depraved they are, are potential members of the Kingdom, and could, given the opportunity, repent and become loyal followers of the LORD. That's why we must forgive all offenses against us.

...

There are certain events associated with the DAY OF THE LORD and THAT DAY in the Old Testament. Our Founding Mother has confused the issue by attributing events occurring in the 1800's with the events that will occur during the LAST DAYS and the TIME OF THE END. We can quickly search for these terms in our computerized Bibles to get a better idea what will happen on and around the DAY OF THE LORD.

If we carefully read all of the prophecies of Daniel we will realize that his visions were symbolic animations of events that will occur during the LAST DAYS, or the TIME OF THE END, not the last several millennia we are familiar with.

Our Founding Mother and Company have also confused our understanding of the LAST DAYS by creating the 1 day = 1 year myth. After several failed 2nd Coming of Christ date prophecies, they settled on an unprovable 1844 event and left the time of the Second Coming open ended, which of course, no one but God knows anyway.

It's true that Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, and Rome were historical empires, but their territories were quite small, especially in comparison with today's superpower governments. Daniel's visions and other OT and NT prophecies indicate that each of these powers will occupy the entire planet. The unnamed fourth world government is probably not Rome.

These four kingdoms arise after a resurrection, and their former leaders are empowered to conquer the whole earth. Historical Nebuchadnezzar's kingdom was nowhere near the scale of Daniel's visions. As a minor king of a tiny empire, he had no power over the birds of the air or the wild animals unless he was the manager of a zoo or wild animal park. The resurrected Nebuchadnezzar will be aided by the weapons and power of Satan to conquer and destroy the great cities of the world.

We already know the rest of the story: the Kingdom of Babylon falls, Persia falls, Greece falls, and ultimately, the Fourth Kingdom falls when the DAY OF THE LORD arrives. It is easy to fail to realize that these rather small historical kingdoms will also play a major role in LAST DAY events. Just because they existed in the distant past doesn't mean we are currently living in the LAST DAYS, as our Church Leaders have been preaching for hundreds or thousands of years.

Fallible men have written down their historical accounts of God's dealings with men. Fallible men have written letters to their fiends and congregations. Fallible men turned these writings into the infallible word of God. If we limit ourselves to their frame of reference, we may misunderstand Reality and create flawed religions as a result of our blurred vision.

Jesus taught us everything we need to know to join his Kingdom. He also warned his listeners, and us, what we will face during the LAST DAYS. At this time, I believe most of us will be awakened during the LAST DAYS to make the final choice between serving the LORD by being branded as his slaves or serving Satan and being branded as his slaves.

If we die for the LORD's sake we will live forever. If we save our lives by becoming Satan's servants, we will live, but only for a little while.

It is also possible that we won't be included in the group living during the Time of Trouble, but that we will instead be awakened at Judgment Day following the DAY OF THE LORD to face our life record along with the rest of humanity. Jesus did seem to indicate that his hearers and readers would be present during the Great Time of Trouble. If so, then we too, should plan on being there and should direct our lives accordingly.

It is difficult finding a correlation of some of the Book of Revelation prophecies with Old Testament prophecies. I've beat myself up trying to unify the two completely. Perhaps there's someone out there who can do it better.

Alien Sanctuary, it is not just a matter of who will prove loyal to God, it is a matter of who in their lives show they choose to side with Good. This is how God judges people, especially those who have not been taught sound doctrine, which would help them realize that God Himself is the Personification of Good.

I have to state categorically that I reject the idea of the whole of the prophecies of Daniel being reapplied to the time of the end. The text itself explicitly tells us to what nations and when these prophecies apply. Anything else is a private interpretation. If we are not going to go by what the text says, then we do not show we truly regard the Bible as the Word of God. It is His Word, His prophecies, which are given for His purposes.

There are portions of the prophecies that do apply to the time of the end. This is indicated in the sequence of events, and even (in the case of Daniel 11:40) the text explicitly says so.

I am surprised that you criticize the symbolic day represents a literal year idea. How do you account for the fact that it works so well? Would you deny the way Daniel 9:24-27 give us the very time when the Messiah was to appear and be annointed and begin His ministry, then that He would be "cut off, but not for Himself" in the "midst of the week" (three and one half years after beginning His ministry)?

If you want something perhaps less familiar to consider, look at the narrative portions of Daniel, and think whether they appear to be types of the experience of God's people in the time of the end. The image erected on the plains of Dura seems to evoke the "Image to the Beast" in Revelation 13. Daniel being cast into the lion's den may suggest the final persecution of God's people, including a death decree, also in Revelation 13. This is worth thinking about, I say.

Ron wrote: "it is not just a matter of who will prove loyal to God, it is a matter of who in their lives show they choose to side with Good. This is how God judges people, especially those who have not been taught sound doctrine, which would help them realize that God Himself is the Personification of Good."

Really? So what happens to a good muslim or even a good athiest? Might want to read Rev. 21:8 and 22:15 to see what happens to anyone who practices a lie or even has a lie in their mouth. Therefore, it appears as though you, Ron, may side with the voice of the serpant. God made it known that one must obey Him. God did not write upon the stone: "Just be good"!

Ron also wrote: "(three and one half years after beginning His ministry)" Ok Ron, let me give you a test. Please find where Jesus' ministry was three and a half years from the writings of the New Testament? I tried and couldn't. All I found was that Jesus' ministry was ONE year. This would agree with what Peter is alleged to have said in Clementine Homilys 17:19.

Dr. Rich, responsible scholars of the New Testament are in agreement that Jesus' ministry lasted about 3 1/2 years. Also, the time prophecy of Daniel 9:24-27 demands it. To reject this is to reject the most important proof of all that Jesus is truly the Messiah.

As for my statement that God judges people by whether they show themselves to be on the side of Good, what would you say is the fate of the person raised in the Western Hemisphere prior to contact by the Europeans, so that he never even had the opportunity to hear of Jesus? Would you just shrug your shoulders and consign the population of half the world to be judged by God "as if they had never been"? Apparently then you do not believe Romans 5:18 which tells us that Jesus justified ALL men.

God arranges tests for everyone, by which they can show in their lives that they would be on God's side if they knew about Him. Or does that sound too merciful and loving to you?

The Anointed One arrives at the end of the 69th "seven".
Following the 69th "seven":
the Anointed One is killed
a ruler will destroy the city and the Temple
the End comes with a flood
war and miseries occur until the very end (Great Time of Trouble)

During the 70th "seven":
the ruler makes a treaty with the people for the entire "seven"

At the 69.5 "seven":
the ruler stops the sacrifices and offerings
sets up the abomination of desolation until he is destroyed


This ruler is also the King of the North of Dan 11.



This same ruler is also the little horn boasting arrogantly on the 4th Beast of Dan 7.





The 4 Beasts of Dan 7 and the 4-in-One Beast of Rev 13 are the same. Their rulers and subjects arise from a turbulent sea of people---those who are resurrected during the Last Days.

From the above quoted verses I would also conclude that the 70 "sevens" of Dan 9 also occur during the Last Days. There may be a partial fulfillment in history, maybe deliberate, maybe just coincidental.

Jesus was an Earth-born Messenger. Perhaps the LORD was his genetic father, or perhaps his DNA was created by the LORD and they considered themselves to be father and son.

We may not know the identity of the Anointed One in Dan 9:25. We can search "anointed" in our Bibles for a different angle.

By comparing Dan 2, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12, and Rev we could conclude that they concern the same time period, the Last Days, (including the messages to the 7 churches in Rev). There may be historical coincidences or counterparts, perhaps intentional, but the Messengers to both Daniel and John indicate the visions and time periods concerned the Time of the End. (not including the 70 years of captivity of Israel Daniel was concerned about)

Ron wrote: "responsible scholars of the New Testament are in agreement that Jesus' ministry lasted about 3 1/2 years. Also, the time prophecy of Daniel 9:24-27 demands it. To reject this is to reject the most important proof of all that Jesus is truly the Messiah."

Well Ron, not the 'responsible scholars' I hang out with. Please do your own research and see what you come up with--and the interesting thing about Daniel is that it does not say anything about the 'ministry itself'. I see that Jesus started His ministry at the time just before passover and He cleaned out His fathers house. When it ended He did the same thing again. thaat makes one year.

As for what it says in Revelation--this is ONLY for those living during the time of trouble for everyone will have a chance to make a choice because of the testimony from the 144,000, the 5 wise and the 2 witnesses. But then who really knows about those living before and then die before the time of trouble? I don't.