Evangelicals and conservatives of the SDA church are both fundamentalists. Neither understand the true nature of divine inspiration, and so both are likely to misinterpret the words of the prophets.

The abyss is simply death.

Is there more coming?

Wow that was very interesting, I must say.

pk

sohel001

1st - -I want to make this very clear, do not copy and paste items with out giving credit to the source and website. Do not plagiarize.

2nd - - Get rid of the link in the signature. Do that today.

Yes .... it was. I too am waiting for the rest. Part 11 or 111. And a reference to be forthwith.

Dear Gentlemen and Ladies,

When did we get the idea that prophets and apostles were infallible. Remember that Scripture is not dictated, it is thought inspired with the prophets putting the thoughts on paper using their own words. There are some errors in Scripture. For instance Matthew attributes a prophecy to Jeremiah when it is from Zechariah. Samuel and Chronicles record the same event where David causes the people to be counted, and God brings judgment. One account says that Satan caused him to do the count, but the other account declares that the Lord caused him to do the count. Which is correct? Do not hold EGW to a higher standard. There are many things which Ellen White stated and used which did not come from the Holy Spirit. Many times she would use the understanding of her day to illustrate a concept. Such was the idea of coal fires being the cause for volcanism. That was the science of her day. This is no different than the Samuel and Chronicles problem; each writer worked under the understanding of his time. Did God cause David to sin? Or did Satan?

God never gave to EGW the authority to determine or dictate doctrine for the Church; it has always been the work of the Church. Many have tried to make her such to their detriment, I might add. And it has never been the right of any one member nor a church board to determine doctrine for the Church. Rather, the General Conference, and that is not the representative body in DC, it is the Church in business session during the general conference held every five years (GC) that is the final authority for doctrine for the SDA Church. It is the result of studies by the world body, then coming together at the GC every five years and voting to accept or reject. EGW is correct when she states that the GC is the highest authority, and we are to accept its vote. We should not cause schism because we disagree with the decisions made at GC. We can continue to study and use the proper channels to forward our studies; I believe the brethern are continually open to further study and light. But we are not to cause a split in the church because we disagree with the decisions made in business session of the five year general conference. Nor should politics and strategy be used to obtain a vote for a position. All needs to be done open and above board in order that God may be honored.

As far as A.G. Daniels suppressing documents, you will find that he was one of those who desired to open up everything to the Adventist people. But the majority in committee decided against it. So please do not assign evil to Daniels. Rather, I find some of the fore-stated history suspect. I would suggest there needs to be authentication of the allegations made. Otherwise, do not accuse with unsubstantiated history. I would suggest do not accuse the brethren without good evidence to do so. Hearsay is not acceptable.

I knew the people in the Ford and the Walter Rheas controversy personally. I personally confronted many of them. They were my classmates in college when I studied for the ministry. They were wrong Scripturally. And no amount of post-historical quarterbacking will make them right. At the same there were many among the church leaders who didn't do the study that should have been done. I left the ministry because I couldn't agree with all the positions taken by the Church. But I didn't leave the SDA Church. Rather, I continued to study until I could come to a position with which I was comfortable. And eventually, I will present my findings through the proper channels and allow the entire church to evaluate my findings. But I will not do anything that will cause the Church to split. There was rebellion and schism during the Ford and Rhea controversies which should never have happened, and many will find themselves outside the gates of the holy city because of their attitude. God was not honored.

The abyss to the Hebrew mind was the ocean depths below the photic zone; it was blackness and unfathomable. They did not know how deep it went; for all they knew, it was unlimited. Thus, in Genesis 1, Moses uses the idea of the abyss as a representation of the darkness and deepness of space. And darkness was over the face of the deep (tehom) and the spirit of God moved over the face of the waters (seas).

Also be careful with 2 Peter 2.4. The word here is Tartarus; it is the Greek word for the chasm where souls are cleansed by fire for a short period of time then are allowed to return to a corporeal body in order to experience another life upon the earth. It is the pagan philosopher's, Plato, concept and became the forerunner of the Catholic purgatory. It is not associated with the abyss. It is a temporary holding place; it is not the final.

Luke 8.31 is best understood according to Jewish thought where the abyss is the region below the photic zone, deep, dark, and impenetrable. Even though the writers of the New Testament wrote in Koine Greek, it does not mean they lost their Jewish concepts of reality and understanding. The abyss was a place of mystery; none knew what was in these dark depths. And lets remember that it was only recently that we have had the capacity to explore below the photic zone of the oceans and deep lakes. Up until this time, everything below the photic depth was a mystery.

And if you want to suggest that there are some people alive after Christ's coming because Isaiah 24.6 seems to indicate this is the case will also have a problem with Isaiah where he states "for the young man shall die a hundred years old", Isaiah 65.20, to suggest that death will exist in eternity. Again, we must be careful and obtain all the statements in Scripture before deriving a conclusion. You cannot use one or two texts to form a doctrine.

I would suggest that the abyss should be understood as that area which is presently unobservable to the naked eye such as the depths of the continents. As I understand scripture, the earth will go through a very cataclysmic time when the very roots of the continents will be exposed and whole mountains chains and islands will disappear. Thus, it would appear that Satan will be chained to the abyssal plains of the earth; those plains now hidden from view. That all which is alive will die at His coming. The earth will be in chaos with its roots exposed and nothing left on which to survive.

Again, let us study scripture diligently with an eye towards glorifying God and not ourselves. Let us earnestly pray over our Scriptural study, and let us march forward to truth. EGW has clearly stated that there is much more to learn and that many of our positions are not totally correct. We have much to learn. Study, Study, Study; pray, pray, pray, and ask God for wisdom. And do not use EGW as the final authority on doctrine, and understand that not all written by her was inspired by God. She used what was available to her in order to bring understanding to the truths presented to her by God. Rather, it is the principles and concepts which are inspired such as the principles of health.

Sincerely,
The Searcher

Searcher, what does your post have to do with "Books for Sale"????

Amen sister, you seem to be a deep studier. We should all be deep studiers.

Dear Friends,

I am sorry; I thought there was some theological discussion concerning the reason for the sale. I am sorry if I mistook the various responses in the wrong way. If I remember correctly there was a discussion concerning the reason for the sale with a theological response by many in regards to these issues. And I do remember a rather large email concerning some conspiracy by the church and Daniels and Froom to cover up and suppress. There was also a discussion how the conservatives are part of the conspiracy. Did I get that wrong? I am truly sorry if I misunderstood the nature of the discussion.

Sincerely,
The Searcher